next weekend is my district convention.
my wife has, in all capital letters, written "district convention" on the calender in the kitchen.. i told her i'm not going.
look, it's too cramped, i have some physical problems that will not allow me to sit, like a grasshopper for hours and hours.
I am stuck going for the whole thing out of town in Kennewick WA. I don't go to meetings, but I have to go to this. Hopefully there will be some protesters there that I can "witness" to during the sessions. Please? June 29th - July 1st? Please? It would make the whole experience worthwhile if I could find others who detest this religion as much as I do.
CCS
anyone here master the art of pressing in the doorbell without really pressing it?
how about knocking where it seems loud on the outside, but you know it can't be heard on the inside.
or standing at a door for up to 5 minutes when you know nobody was there.
The sevice overseer made new territories. I checked one out for service. He didn't realize there were only 8 houses in the whole territory. I had to work it 3 times to get my time in.
Sorry. Bad joke but I couldn't resist. I havent't been in service in 5 years. Up to then only 2 times in the previuos 3. As a kid and early adult, coffee break was the only reason to go out. I'll never forget how the dubs would be quite timid about new CO. No one would mention "break" until the new CO did and that guy would set the tone for the next 3 years. Everyone was happy or annoyed depending an what the CO did. A bunch of posers would inflict the new CO's "break" rule in his absence. Keep in mind that these are the same guys who in real life could barely hold a part time job as an apprentice food chewer, but they were the "Shepard's of the Flock". What a crock.
CCS
i dont have any statistics but am curious if there could be any truth to it; that it might be easier for a witness to stop believing vs a christian.
i dont see this at any of the churches i have attended; people leaving in droves with some totally discarding any belief.. 1 the jw org is the only truth.
you question its authority, then you question god.
I personally think that it is much easier for this to happen. A dub hears his whole life how "this is the only way to life." When a dub starts to question his beliefs, a landslide begins. From what I personally have experienced, it begins with a trickle and goes all the way to no god. When your whole life is only one correct way to life, then once the questions start, nothing is sacred any longer. As this process goes on, you suddenly feel the freedom to look at all things with new eyes and your mind is free to explore all possibilities. It is a wonderful thing to no longer be under the chains of control that have been heaped upon us all our lives.
I am finally free to be happy about who I am by myself, as myself, without the constant worry that I may offend someone if I don't think and act as THEY think I should. I have finally been able to accept me for who I am, not who I feel that THEY think I should be. What freedom and happiness I now have. Even my wife who is a dub can see the difference-although she would never admit that it took me telling her that I was done with dubs before this great change came about. I am much more confident and sure of my decisions. I no longer worry about whether or not it will affect my attendance or service time. NO MORE GUILT!!!
I can research all I want to and make my own decision about who or what god is to me. I do not need an organization of any persuasion to help me with my faith. Long story short-when the floodgates of doubt finally begin to open, I believe many will no longer believe in god.
CCS
i left the organization in my heart a year ago, i stopped going to meetings a week ago.
this was recently announced for the upcoming convention.
jeans and t-shirts are not to be worn in public after each day's convention program.
I am stuck going to the convention this year as my wife is still a follower. I have not worn a badge at the assembly for 15 years. This year I intend to get one so that can wear it on my tank top after the sessions while we go out to eat. Yes what a witness I will give in my tank top, shorts and sandals with a badge on. I can only hope I run in to people I used to know.
Ok, yeah your right. My wife will throw a caniption if I do that, but please, is there anyone out there who can? I would love to hear about the results. If it were only me by myself, I could do it. But we will be with the kids and her whole family-no chance. I am however going to dress comfortable after word. I will not make my kids wear their suits and dress. Life is too short to let stupid rules get in the way of freedom. My god, how much more obtuse can these guys get? Next year dubs will be required to eat dinner in their rooms or at the convention to avoid any contact with real people. It just gets better and better. This must be the "sorting" work. "Real dubs wear Khakis". " Old dubs never die, they just blend in with the dirt."
"Nice pants. Do they sell men's pants where you bought those brother?"
CCS
for me it was a combination of things over a long period of time.
being raised as a witness, you do things by rote.
but when you see sooooooooo many watchtower inconsistencies, mistreatment of the "brothers", elder abuse, and simple lack of love, it begins to make you start seriously thinking.
I am like so many others on this board. When you start to put all the problems together, you realize that it is all a house of cards that cannot stand up to any scrutiny. Combine that with the only defense they have-attack the individual with questions-and you know without a doubt that it's all a lie.
I have a friend who has a great saying that really applies to "The Truth": "You can't polish a turd."
CCS
perhaps one should a jw this question.. then ask them ,how come his teachings have been altered if he was teaching truth?.
I brought up Russell to my father. He asked why? I then brought up Rutherford and he asked if I was going to bring up Knorr as well. You need to realize that my dad is 65 and born and raised a dub, is now an elder and has been one off and on since they started the elder thing. His next question was "What does Russell have to do with anything?" I was shocked. i then realized that he is old school, which means that dubs are not a religion and the idea that a man started their religion is preposterous.
He really believes that it is god's religion-man has nothing to do with it. When I then skipped all the people and asked him why the bible hadn't changed in 2000 years but that dubs today believe differently than dubs 50 years ago, he called me an apostate and told me to leave.
I guess my point is that a true dub doesn't see any importance in Russell or any of the early controllers of the faith. They only see what is truth now-a complete disconnect happens when new "light" changes old. There is nothing in their make-up that allows for this type of reasoning. I found it quite ironic that I was being labeled an apostate when I was only stating fact from their history and quoting their publications. It is their only defense-attack the individual, not the message.
The only person that this reasoning will work on is someone who is already looking to find answers to all of the obvious questions.
CCS
i read yesterday that the un website has removed the info about the wtbs being an ngo.
here is the link that is still active.
i just looked it up myself.. http://www.un.org/dpi/ngosection/ngo-docs.asp.
I read yesterday that the UN website has removed the info about the WTBS being an NGO. Here is the link that is still active. I just looked it up myself.
http://www.un.org/dpi/ngosection/ngo-docs.asp
I hope I did not misunderstand the post from yesterday, but the above link is still active.
hey i'll come back and do some, but does anyone want to kick start it?
...You condemn those who watch Harry Potter movies while you alphabetize your DVD's of "Wizard of Oz", Star Wars (all 6), The Little Mermaid..... Then when asked about what the difference is you say "There is a difference between Fantasy Magic and Real Magic."
When a special assembly day is mentioned, you start shopping for new clothes.
After you get puke sick drunk at the bar, you say it must have been alcohol poisoning.
AFTER pleasuring yourself, you pray for forgiveness.
You grow a goatee when on vacation, and shave it off just before meeting starts when you get back.
Laugh at a dirty joke when no dubs can see you.
Put on sunglasses and a hat to go into the strip-club and park your car 3 blocks away.
Go camping as an excuse to get wasted every night you are there.
Go to morning meeting Superbowl Sunday.
Fill your trash can with all the old mags you didn't place.
When you say "That movie looks so good-too bad it's rated R".
Rent R movies when your family is out of town and noone can see you.
i'm wide awake at 2 a.m., with my mind ruminating on stuff i should leave alone.
i wish i could turn it off in the night, when worries spin out of control.
let me list my concerns: this was my 26th wedding anniversary, and my husband forgot it apparently.
Hello. I don't often post here, but this topic caught my eye. My wife and I have had our share of difficulties over the years. We have on several occasions come close to splitting up. But as many will tell you, the main problem has always been communication and understanding. When one gets into a certain frame of mind-hurt, anger, resentment-the most dificult and least appealing road is the one where these ideas are shared with the personwho seems to be the cause of the problem.
You may think that you are the only one with an issue, but I guarantee that he also has an issue or 2. The best way to come to a resolution is to open you heart first and let him know how you feel-without the anger and resentment. Ask him to let you know what issues he may have with you, and then be open minded enough to look at yourself objectively to see if maybe he does have a point. Yes, all of this is easier said than done, but rarely is the problem only one sided. I am going on 20 years with my woman-and I thank god everyday that we have stayed together. No one can make me as angry or happy as she. I would not trade her for anything. I suspect that your husband deep down feel the same way, but does not know how to approach the subject. That is why we need you-women. We are te worst communicators in the world. It is easier to fight and then 10 minutes later want sex because we have said our piece.
If you want this to work-as it sounds that you are at a crossroad-then you need to do this as gently as possible so that he does not get defensive.; Tell him your faults 1st, then ask gently if he can see where he might need to change a few things. I am no counselor, but hen my wife approaches me this way, we accomplish a lot more than when we hurl accusations and supposed hurts at each other.
I wish you well-whatever the outcome. It can't get much worse and if things don't work out then at least you have the peace of mind that you tried all avenues. Remember also that you need to make sure that leaving him is not just changing one set of problems for anoher. If that is the case, then you have to decide which set is better.
CCS
it is finally out there.
my dad has finally faced it.
he screamed that i am "apostate".
It is finally out there. My dad has finally faced it. He screamed that I am "Apostate". I am 40 yo, and have been moving this way for years. I have purposely avoided the talk with my parents. I blew up at my dad back in January when all the hubbub was going on about how Matt. 24:14 had been considered fulfilled. He called to tell me the "End" was coming because the WTBS said so. I lost it and told him to quit trying to scare me vack to meetings. I even asked him "Are you calling to tell me the End is coming-AGAIN?" I went on a little tirade and finally he asked if I was done, and I said that I was-finally-and hung up the phone.
I haven't seen them since then. Haven't talked to them since. I was in their town last week, so I thought I would stop by. We did the obligatory small talk. Very uncomfortable. Then pop, who is an elder, gets to the meat. Wants to know what my problems are. He, of course, already knows that deep down I know it is the truth. I disagree. 1st time ever. I tell him that the only thing I need is the bible. He asks what religion is going to bring me to god? "Not a single one. I do not need an organization to tell me how to live my life. I have all the principles right in front of me. I have the bible." I only wish I could have kept my cool.
It got ugly after that. I lost it. I do not yet understand where all of this anger is from. I cannot have a single discussion with anyone on this topic without there being anger on my side. I did not want to talk to my folks about this because I knew it would get ugly. When I started to speak about Russell and Rutherford, he asked "Why? What do they have to do with anything? Are you going to bring up Knorr too ?" I was stunned. He actually does not think that these MEN were influential in his religion. When I dared to call the dubs a religion, he was dumfounded that I would even think of them as a religion. I had forgotten how wrong it is as a dub to refer to the dubs as a religion.
I then said that in 2500 years the bible, except for translation changes, had basically remained the same. But in the history of the dubs, nothing was the same. "What happened dad? Did God change his mind? This is God's voice on earth and he can't keep make up his mind?" I then grabbed the Revelation book and tried to read something from it. At that point he also lost it and started the battle cry for dubs that gives them their arrogance and protection. "YOU ARE AN APOSTATE! YOU ARE AN APOSTATE! YOU HAVE COMMITTED IMMORALITY AND THAT GUILT IS WHY YOU CANNOT ACCEPT THE TRUTH!" He grabbed the book from me and told me to get out. I left. I was so angry and more words passed on my way out, but I don't really remember what was said.
I drove away mad. 2 minutes later I was on my way back. I could not leave it like that. I went back, my mom let me in and I told her that I loved them both and that I did not come to their house to have this discussion. I respected their faith and apologized for being disrespectful in their home. My mom was fine. She got my pop and I had to say it all over again. He was still hot and barely accepted my olive branch. I never backed down about how I feel, I just wanted them to know that no matter what, they were my parents and my anger was not justified. As I walked out the door, I told mhy mom that it was obvious that they would no longer speak with me. she said she would always talk to me-regardless. I then said " Mom, the bible does not teach such a thing. It does not tell us to shun each other for different beliefs. The bible teaches love mom, not hatred." Then I left.
Needless to say, this affected me more than I thought it wpould. What my father chooses to do with the info I have no idea. I do not currently belong to any congo, so it would be difficult to talk to an elder about me. My wife and kids go haphazardly to a hall, but I honestly think he won't do anything. For him, the loss of face by admitting that his son is apostate will probably keep him quiet. As long as I don't make any waves with the rest of the family, then I think I can just be considered inactive. My only concern is the los of friends in a different city if he pursues this any further. I want it both ways.
If people think I go, but am not apostate, then I can still talk to them. Also, it makes it easier on my family. I am still a little stunned about the whole immorality issue. Apparently a person is not able to think on their own unless they have sinned. It is amazing to me that the immediate "out" to excuse my attitude is sin. "He is running from his sin." How transparent is that? Noone will ever leave the dubs if they 1st don't sin. That is probably the most telling and enlightening thing to come out of this. Think about it. It is very similar to what happened to Eve and Adam. They disobey, so suddenly they realize they are naked. I do not believe, therefore I must have sinned. If that is all it took to get my mind right, I would have done it years ago and never stopped. I have a wife and kids. I will not lose them for something so unimportant as immorality. My life is good, why would I risk the loss of it? I already am traveling a tough path caused by my current stand. I am not going to make it that much more difficult.
Anyway, that is my rant. I have got to get to work. I had to get this out. Thanks for the hearing ear. I will check back tonight for any good thoughts.
CCS
